Warlords and Merchants Discussion

[Xenon]

I'm pretty sure you still can't add abilities to a unit with triggers That was added to WC3 in the expansion, so maybe...

[Mucky]

>spend hours coding spells in data editor
>end up with a spell that hurls command centers at light speed across the map

I am having way too much fun with this.

[EVWeb]

>spend hours coding spells in data editor
>end up with a spell that hurls command centers at light speed across the map

I am having way too much fun with this.

ooooo, I WANT IT!!!!!!!!!

[Vetraeus]

I have a fully functioning spell that allows a Siege Tank to launch a giant baneling 150rt via map on splash effect artillery, chances of it missing a standing target? 50%, chances of it hitting a mass of standing targets? 100%, Chance of the splash effect killing your workers? 500%. Its still pretty buggy though, but I have tried using other projectiles/structure/units and so far its good, If it makes you feel better I can launch Planetary Fortresses, Hives, and Pylons.

>Addunit-De_BuildStructure(LaunchS_150D^_Disable)>Move<|LocationHitScan-Disabled-NoticeVector30,60
<Setloadout-UnitCostValues+GenerateInteger/Attack[Pulse]
EffectVector4-9>Assume<SpellLocation>_SetMOVER\Agitate

And some other oddly designed triggers.

[Ricky_Honejasi]

So with the Surveyor in, odds are games are likely to last much less longer now and potential hilarity could come out of their use.

Latest changes for FFS :

A) Added Elite - Surveyor (Lv2)
B) Fixed some Landzone buttons.
C) Added some workarounds to borrow resources.
D) Attempted a fix to prevent a deviated Flux Vanes researchable by Merchants.
E) Elite - Atomic Crusader now have aerial sight.
F) You can type -ragequit to act as -surrender.
G) Elite - Scantolisk have less damage for ground attacks.
H) Kerrigan is now also Massive.
I) Kerrigan is now any noticeable when burrowed.

EDIT : Also, I couldn't fix everything for the buttons on the HQ. For some twisted reason, if I even make a basic ability based on "Effect - Instant", I seem to get the error "Target is not in range" NO MATTER WHAT.

Heck, I even made the SAME steps as usual on a side map. No problem. Then I copy said working ability into W&M then I get that "Target is not in range" bullshit.

For Landzones, I was able to trick my way in with abilities based on "Morph" pointing on the Landzone itself so that it does nothing in the grand scheme while allowing my triggers to fire.

However, the same trick became tricky for the HQ as it does researches. I tried a few other things but ultimately had to make chat message triggers ( "-bmin X" to borrow minerals and "-bgas X" respectively) just to get the same relative functionally in some way or another.

But seriously, that "Target is not in range" issue for instant spells is so bullshit.

EDIT 2 : Just checked a bit more for Q's Survevor and I noticed his ability is based on "Behavior" which could have been enough for my needs but I am getting too tired right now to start redoing stuff.

[IskatuMesk]

You need a -inane option to enforce that silly sandbox mode pathing on normal games.

[Krazy]

So the nydus thing actually makes zerg fun, shockingly enough. Really, it's not that big of an advantage; it allows for some nifty sneak attacks but Warlord Defenders and PFs still crush them, and if you're not careful spamming them can suck up your gas income really fast. The main appeal is being able to launch an attack where your units are unlikely to die in great numbers. My economy that game with Ricky and EV was actually much worse through almost the entire game, but since I was losing so few in unit consumption I never needed many more. Spamming atomic crusaders is just so much more expensive.

The main issues I see is that with the Hercules, detection is just really a big issue. I know you have surveyors and stuff but unless merchants actually create them, it's just ridiculous trying to defend anything with the shimmering invisible balls of death flying around everywhere.

[Krazy]

ON THE OTHER HAND

Who really suffers with the current stuff-in-bikes-in-transports thing is the MERCHANTS. If people aren't losing guys, then people aren't buying new stuff. What ends up happening is the gas economy of the merchants goes into the drain; Mesk didn't really feel the difference I think but he did keep running out of gas, and I felt a HUGE difference between this week and last week as a merchant.

[IskatuMesk]

I proclaim victory over the french and Starcraft 2.

However, as I watched and played with these new abominations in realtime (though I've never used the worm deal yet), I actually started to wonder. Do we really want to totally remove these things?

I like the idea of being able to pick and choose units and combine them into a flying transport of death. You can go for utility like mass goliaths (multilock renders this stupidly op though), or you can go for demolition with mass dt/warp zealots. Or reapers/marines for the cheap and quick route. Mass snowglobes gave mucky some holding strength against even mass carriers, but he couldn't penetrate my defenses.

There is some blatantly broken shit about this, but I think it could be turned into a feature with a bit of effort. Of course, judging by ricky's statements during the game, he fully intended to dump the map previous to being subjected to the horrors I had unleashed. I will remember this, though, if I ever make something myself. I think it has some potential behind it.

-

Also, this was my first time ever playing as a merchant other than when I sand boxed with hks/mucky to test my theories. I pointed out a few things to ricky, like the desire for buildings to all have unique graphics, but I'm sure he knows about that stuff. Playing as a merchant is really unnerving coming from the warlord's perspective, because you hold such a HUGE amount of power over the game but remain completely detached from it. Just like politics! Now I know why every politician is soulless.

[Xenon]

I think Ricky should keep this version uploaded separately. (mumble mumble stupid publishing)

I tried to figure out how to use behaviors to disable stuff in a bike from firing when the bike is hidden, but the "iterate transport" effect type appears to be completely broken. It doesn't even work for what it's supposed to do in the campaign, kill cargo in overlords you mind control.

Edit: You should be able to make a transport load validator that won't allow bikes to be loaded if they have anything in them (try the 'has no cargo' validator since I don't think any other transportable ground unit can load cargo.)

And seriously, check if merchant buildings have footprints already. I can't do it myself (I H8 map protection)

[IskatuMesk]

You know you can just open the maps, right? They aren't actually protected...

[Xenon]

"Unable to load file (Core: file not found): ComponentList.SC2Components"

And of course they have to name it a jumble of hex values and stow it in one of 5000 folders where only the search can find it by modified date. I did manage to use an MPQ editor to look at the XML, and the buildings do have a footprint.

[IskatuMesk]

Well, that's enough to check. They might have changed something down the line, but the maps really aren't protected seeing as you can rebuild them from that data

Such a waste of resources. The time spent making a faulty protection system should have gone into making the game not horrible.

[Xenon]

Yes... all this restrictive junk just hampers the end user and the community. I still think the "marketplace" is one of the major causes of all this overregulation.

[IskatuMesk]

I hope that thing never comes to light. Any shred of hope the game has for a custom content community will die immediately if it does. I guess that wouldn't effect us (unless Ricky feels like abandoning his internship for bluzzard funbucks), but considering how many people were in it just for the vain hope of making money when the game first came out... ugh.