Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

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Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Mucky » Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:18 pm

that's right all you african americans i got beta

Okay, so, I've only played around 5 or 6 games, mainly as Zerg. Time for some first impressions:

- Workers and troops having separate rallies is a wonderful idea and it's brilliantly implemented. Highlight of SC2's interface.

- Zerg needs far less hatcheries than they did in SC1. The Queen's ability to spam larva makes one hatchery in SC2 equivalent to two or even three hatcheries in SC1. I mean this thing gives you a shitload of larva, it makes one base Zerg the main style of play.

- Early roaches seem to be Zerg's best option. My build order, made entirely without any thought: 10/10 overlord, 13/18 pool, 12/18 gas, 15/18 roach warren, 14/18 queen. Pretty soon I'm just spamming larva and pumping Roaches. By the 7 minute mark, I have 30 Roaches. Most people have no idea how to handle this kind of pressure. I'm hoping this is just because I'm playing newbies, and the more experienced players would expect and plan for Roaches.

- Okay, so Roaches are powerful, but I don't think they're a "good" unit. Why is this unit in the game? What was wrong with the Hydralisk being the tier 1.5 unit? They just had to stick in this incredibly bland unit that can't attack air and put Hydras higher up the tree. Oh, and it regens faster while burrowed. Blizzard can just go ahead and rename them Crypt Fiends.

- Infestors are bad. I have no idea why Blizzard is trying to keep this unit in the game.

- The Overlord's ability to shit creep anywhere they want is kind of interesting, though I can't think of much use for it except for making a path for the Queen to travel on. The Overseer's Changeling ability, on the other hand, is not very interesting at all. I don't understand why Zerg has all of these gimmick abilities.

- The Mutalisk doesn't morph into anything. The Corruptor, an anti-air unit, morphs into the Brood Lord, an anti-ground unit. what the fuck broseidon

One more thing: MBS production. Who thought it would be a good idea to have only one larva turn into an egg when the player has 12 selected?

"Want 12 hydras? Well, we can't have you getting all of them with one button like in SC1. That's too easy. We want you to mash the fucking hotkey until you break your keyboard."

I honestly cannot comprehend the logic behind this decision. There is no strategic difference in having the player press H 12 times to get 12 Hydras and pressing H only once. Which means this is a matter of having more twitch/management in the game (isn't that why we have the Queen?). Blizzard is going out of its way to cater to people who whine and think their opinion is more important because they're "competitive" and Dustin Browder is obsessed with making SC2 an e-sport.

That's all for now.

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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby IskatuMesk » Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:39 pm

Yes the MBS thing is fucking stupid, just wait 'till you have 30 lings and want to turn em all into banelings. Happy button mashing!

Overlord creep can be used to deny expansions.

Changeling can be fairly useful once you get used to dropping them into people's bases on every cd.

Roaches are fucking stupid, and you basically just described the 1hatch roach cookie cutter build 99% of the zerg players are using right now.
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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Mucky » Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:45 pm

IskatuMesk wrote:Overlord creep can be used to deny expansions.


Sweet. I wonder how long it would've taken me to think of that.

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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby IskatuMesk » Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:49 pm

wats ur sn
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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Mucky » Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:51 pm

Mucky.buttes

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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby IskatuMesk » Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:53 pm

excellent perhaps we can play tomorrow or late tonight

I'm encoding a KHB game where he uses infestors to great effect, might give you some ideas. Aids does 37 damage and kills unlike plague, so a stimmed marine without shield upgrade is dead from this without dropshuttle healing it. MC is pretty ridiculous and quite spammable.
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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Hercanic » Sat Mar 06, 2010 8:35 am

Mucky wrote:- Early roaches seem to be Zerg's best option. My build order, made entirely without any thought: 10/10 overlord, 13/18 pool, 12/18 gas, 15/18 roach warren, 14/18 queen. Pretty soon I'm just spamming larva and pumping Roaches. By the 7 minute mark, I have 30 Roaches. Most people have no idea how to handle this kind of pressure. I'm hoping this is just because I'm playing newbies, and the more experienced players would expect and plan for Roaches.

8/10 Overlord ensures continuous Drone production.


Mucky wrote:- The Overlord's ability to shit creep anywhere they want is kind of interesting, though I can't think of much use for it except for making a path for the Queen to travel on. The Overseer's Changeling ability, on the other hand, is not very interesting at all. I don't understand why Zerg has all of these gimmick abilities.

An essentially free, renewable scout that is not auto-attacked? I think it's a fine replacement for Parasite.


Mucky wrote:- The Mutalisk doesn't morph into anything. The Corruptor, an anti-air unit, morphs into the Brood Lord, an anti-ground unit. what the fuck broseidon

Yeah, Muta-lisk, muta = mutation. However, I think it works out. The Mutalisk is always valuable, whereas a Corruptor is only necessary while the enemy has heavy air. When that's taken care of, you can transition them into siege units to demolish their bases.


Mucky wrote:One more thing: MBS production. Who thought it would be a good idea to have only one larva turn into an egg when the player has 12 selected?

"Want 12 hydras? Well, we can't have you getting all of them with one button like in SC1. That's too easy. We want you to mash the fucking hotkey until you break your keyboard."

I honestly cannot comprehend the logic behind this decision. There is no strategic difference in having the player press H 12 times to get 12 Hydras and pressing H only once. Which means this is a matter of having more twitch/management in the game (isn't that why we have the Queen?). Blizzard is going out of its way to cater to people who whine and think their opinion is more important because they're "competitive" and Dustin Browder is obsessed with making SC2 an e-sport.

That's all for now.

While I understand the convenience when massing, I find "one unit per click" helpful when making mixed forces. In SC1, I would have to carefully hand-select the larva I wanted for each set of unit types.

What I would recommend to Blizzard, however, is if holding Shift when you click or push a hotkey to build a unit, it executes that order as many times as resources and larva/queue space allow, for all races. Want all your Barracks to churn out Marines? Shift+M.
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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Death_Wing » Sat Mar 06, 2010 8:56 am

if i could rate your post i would do a +1.

But here's pie instead!
What?

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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Mucky » Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:32 pm

Hercanic wrote:8/10 Overlord ensures continuous Drone production.


Does it matter? If the larvae timings are the same as SC1, the third one pops out at the same time the Overlord hatches and there will be no idle time. You can wait until the 10th drone to hatch the overlord, or you can delay two of your drones for a faster overlord. I don't think either choice yields a tangible economic boost. I would have to check, though. If I'm wrong and there is idle time on the larvae, I would need to rethink my build order.

An essentially free, renewable scout that is not auto-attacked? I think it's a fine replacement for Parasite.


Of all the ways Zerg has to scout, I think using Overlords are the simplest and most effective. I'll admit I've only used the Changeling while sandboxing, but from what I've gathered you need to use it the same way Parasite was used. In other words, the opponent should not notice you using it; if they did, they would kill it right away. Instead of using methods that rely on your opponent's failure to react, I would prefer using an Overlord.

One thing the Changeling does have over the Parasite is that, like you said, you get it for free with the Overseer. Having to go out of your way to get Queens made Parasite especially unworthy.

Yeah, Muta-lisk, muta = mutation. However, I think it works out. The Mutalisk is always valuable, whereas a Corruptor is only necessary while the enemy has heavy air. When that's taken care of, you can transition them into siege units to demolish their bases.


That's a nice way of looking at it... It's just weird that the Mutalisk has nothing to morph into, after having two advanced forms in SC1.

While I understand the convenience when massing, I find "one unit per click" helpful when making mixed forces. In SC1, I would have to carefully hand-select the larva I wanted for each set of unit types.

What I would recommend to Blizzard, however, is if holding Shift when you click or push a hotkey to build a unit, it executes that order as many times as resources and larva/queue space allow, for all races. Want all your Barracks to churn out Marines? Shift+M.


Good idea, but I'd also like an option to reverse the shortcut. Say, Shift-(hotkey) is the default method to mass units, and you could click a checkbox and have it become (hotkey) instead. And, for that matter, an option to change hotkeys. We should be able to control how the interface works.

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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Lavarinth » Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:39 pm

It's over. I can't play anymore. I'm just going to get raped by Mucky.
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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby IskatuMesk » Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:04 pm

My zerg BO is something like 13 hatch if I see a good FE opportunity, otherwise 13 pool, 15 vis versa, get queen when pool pops, gas somewhere before pool finishes then progress as desired.
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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Xelxiuz » Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:43 pm

Blizzard is going out of its way to cater to people who whine and think their opinion is more important because they're "competitive" and Dustin Browder is obsessed with making SC2 an e-sport.


You do realize SC:BW/E-sport scene/KESPA/etc has never been touched by the chrome dome of West Wood right? I don't see why anyone expects anything just because it's Blizzard.

You should remember Sumsy, and he freaking won the global RA2 tournament. That's the idiot that cries at DOTA that his hero won't listen to him.

Oh good times, good times.

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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Mucky » Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:38 am

Xelxiuz wrote:You should remember Sumsy, and he freaking won the global RA2 tournament. That's the idiot that cries at DOTA that his hero won't listen to him.


I miss Sumsy. Remember when I was Shadowfiend and I was soloing against his Stealth Assassin? Raped.

So far I haven't had a 1v1 that's lasted beyond ten minutes. Whether I play Terran or Zerg, I just have gobs and gobs of units merely five minutes in.

Barracks grouping is kind of clumsy. It doesn't differentiate between the ones with reactors and the ones with tech labs. If I'm not careful and train marines first, it'll train them at the barracks with the tech labs, then when I want marauders I can't make any. I can avoid this by putting barracks with reactors and barracks with tech labs in separate hotkey groups, but it's still an annoyance.

The screen tears every now and then. No idea why... I'm using a 5870 with all settings on max and 1920x1200 resolution.

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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby Lavarinth » Sun Mar 07, 2010 12:31 pm

Sounds like overheating, could also just be dust.
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Re: Mucky SC2 Beta Coverage

Postby IskatuMesk » Sun Mar 07, 2010 1:29 pm

Mucky wrote:Barracks grouping is kind of clumsy. It doesn't differentiate between the ones with reactors and the ones with tech labs. If I'm not careful and train marines first, it'll train them at the barracks with the tech labs, then when I want marauders I can't make any. I can avoid this by putting barracks with reactors and barracks with tech labs in separate hotkey groups, but it's still an annoyance.

The screen tears every now and then. No idea why... I'm using a 5870 with all settings on max and 1920x1200 resolution.


1 - You need to tab between them. I find it only selects the barracks/starports with tech labs when I hotkey the entire things I have to tab to the ones with reactors.

2 - No vsync
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