Warlords and Merchants Discussion

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IskatuMesk
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby IskatuMesk » Mon Apr 18, 2011 11:44 am

I am now thinking that what makes banelings so apeshit retarded is not just hitscan but that insane merchant upgrade. How much exactly of a radius is that giving them? It seems retarded.
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Vetraeus » Mon Apr 18, 2011 1:38 pm

If i remember correctly its +25% and bonus to armored.
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Mucky » Tue Apr 19, 2011 1:13 am

Everyone needs to see this cast:
Wangwung Part 1
Wangwung Part 2
Wangwung Part 3
Wangwung Part 4
Wangwung Part 5
Wangwung Part 6
Wangwung Part 7
Wangwung Part 8

After watching gratuitous amounts of carriers (with immortal shields, at that) melting to phantom scourge many times throughout the game, I honestly think they should be removed from the game. That, or they need to lose everything except permanent cloaking. With splash, invis and charge combined into one unit, anything unfortunate enough to incur their wrath is guaranteed to die. Also keep in mind that they have 4.5 speed, faster than any flying unit in the game, and that's WITHOUT charge.

Splash damage in general needs to be toned down. This is partly my fault for introducing the giant baneling. So, if it comes down to that, I have no problem with them being removed.

Also, static defenses splash air? I had no clue that they did... no wonder Mutalisks are useless on this map. I can see its purpose in stemming Void Ray masses, but they tend to fan out enough to avoid the splash, so the splash is only really hurting units that either can't avoid it (BCs and Carriers) or are a non-factor anyway (Mutalisks and possibly Wraiths/Banshees)

These are the main things I want to see:
1) Phantom Scourge nerfed/removed
2) Giant Baneling nerfed/removed
3) Adv. Research Baneling AoE upgrade removed
4) Splash from the combo BCs/Carriers Yamato ability removed
5) Valkyries removed
6) Corsairs removed
7) Implementing the defense morph tiers I suggested a while back (while also reducing/removing the splash defense does to air)

5 and 6 are mostly to avoid air battles from becoming the cheesy splashfests they are right now... but another reason is that both of these units lack proper graphics. The Devourer also lacks a model, but its role is too precious for the Zerg to lose. In any case, these units are an eyesore. I'm sure Mesk can sympathize with this.

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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby IskatuMesk » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:13 am

I'm sure some models exist if you know where to look. The hero phoenix model can work for the corsair but not being bent out of shape like it is right now.
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Vetraeus » Tue Apr 19, 2011 9:18 am

I have the following models at my disposal:

SC1 BW/SC2 Cut Units:
--Carrier
--Defiler
--Corsair
--Queen
--Dragoon
--Devourer (Very clunky and awkward)
--Guardian (lopsided?)
--Valkyrie (Very clunky)
--Purifier Destroyer (Protoss unit that was cut from Closed Beta's Campaign)
--Arbiter (Tried 3D textiles they eat my computer)
--Shuttle
--Reaver (Needs more work)
--Targeting Drone (Another cut unit, was implemented for the Raven or Science vessel)

SC1 & SC2 Cut and Set Structures:
--Shield Battery: Protoss (Its a CIRCLE!, that is if your graphics are on low.)
--Arbiter Tribunal
--Observatory
--Nuclear Missile Silo
--Sunken Colony (Works perfectly)
--Queen's Nest
--Munitions Depot (SC2)

Now I place a notice here: Some of these models do or do not work, if you want them I will direct you to them or transfer them, but just note that these models absorb lots of space.
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby IskatuMesk » Tue Apr 19, 2011 9:39 am

I think a flattened razor swarm can work for dark swarm and we could sure use a defiler/corsair model right now, and perhaps the dragoon if it looks any good.
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby UntamedLoli » Tue Apr 19, 2011 8:07 pm

As it turns out you can just edit the XML files in the map and the editor will see it without an issue, whoever said otherwise is an idiot because this makes copying shit infinitely easier.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfrHtTJxpWA

Youtube is also terrible and turned any form of audio into static.
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Xenon » Tue Apr 19, 2011 9:50 pm

There's an unused model called fungal swarm that could work well for Yggdrasill swarms.

Also the reason so many things have a bonus to armored is to make a crude imitation of the "explosive" damage type in SC1, but it doesn't work so well without a an equivalent to "medium" size. Either something is armored or it's light with very few exceptions.

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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby IskatuMesk » Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:11 am

yay scourge that work sensibly
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Vetraeus » Wed Apr 20, 2011 8:37 am

Theres a download file here for certain models, most of them at least. No one wants see a Bloated Defiler anymore.

http://www.sc2mapster.com/assets/starcr ... /#comments
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Lavarinth » Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:27 am

No one wants green tints either *cough*
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Vetraeus » Wed Apr 20, 2011 11:21 am

The untange-able urge to tint things Red-orange, Gold, or Green, next thing you'll see is "Red" or "Pink"
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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Xenon » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:59 pm

As it turns out you can just edit the XML files in the map and the editor will see it without an issue, whoever said otherwise is an idiot because this makes copying shit infinitely easier.


I tried this and while it appears to work in the data editor, looking at the xml file in the import manager (reserved names checked) causes it to show a dependency xml instead. Extracting it yields the correct one anyway, but I don't know if there will be any other odd effects.

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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Bishotron » Thu Apr 21, 2011 1:09 pm

Ahoy hoy~!

Ok, I don't know if this has been brought up before, but...
Ricky is all about 'counters" in the WM game. And in the recent games, as I am sure so many of us know, most people go Protoss these days and do mass PhotonCannon Spam. Once you add in hardened shields, it gives the Protoss an incredable advantage in terms of expanding and securing new areas that Zerg, and ESPECIALLY Terran cannot match

SO! And this Idea actually comes from my bother, but I propose a unit that ALL races can build as automated deffense. And that unit would be, the "Flame Predition Turret" from the campaing. It's cheap, easy to make and the fact that it "cloaks" would add a whole new level to the game play. Plus, you can offer the following upgrades:
Phase one; Basic turret. Phase two, AA Helion upgrade (so it can hit air and ground) Phase Three: Detection. to detect cloaked units.

Making this open for ALL races will put a lot of power back into zerg and terran players. Yet having it need upgrades means it isn't a massive change in the natural advantage Protoss recieve

What say you people?

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Re: Warlords and Merchants Discussion

Postby Vetraeus » Thu Apr 21, 2011 3:24 pm

We all know that "Ricky" is lazy and more than likely this will not happen. I recommend handing the map over to Mesk for balancing issues. Aside from that, I would like to see Terrans get Sentry-Guns and Flaming betties, and for zerg to get an Automated (Carrier style) Scourge nest that launches scourge at nearby air units and a Zergling nest that spawns occassional units that attack nearby enemies with a random group spawn. (Zergling, Hydra, Ultralisk, Roach, etc.)
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