Redesigning Starcraft [Redux]


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Fey
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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Fey » Sun May 22, 2016 11:13 pm

Oh wow! You know, I was planning on doing a playthrough on Youtube of this campaign, lol. I'm gonna comment on your vid!

You're awesome! I'm thrilled that anyone is so interested in my work. Thank you. :)

I can't wait to see you do some of the harder maps, like TM06 or TM09, and the maps I worked the most on, namely TM7 and TM10.

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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby noname » Wed Jun 01, 2016 3:55 pm

I`m a multiplayer (1v1 mainly) player myself, but I really enjoy quality campagins, too bad that there aren`t any new campaigns coming out.
I played the original campaign of SC and BW countless times, played the coop mood several times too, and played nearly all campaigns 1-2 times, just anything good to play what I could take my hands on. So I jumped into this, here`s my feedback:

Spoiler: show
1st map:
It`s ok, but instead of devouring ones I`d suggest to put more zerglings with speed and burrow, and more timed attacks.

2nd map:
Pretty good.
Suggestion: Remove the infinite queen spawn, as it doesn`t looks good.

3rd map:
I really like how you made an alternative option, even though it`s way too easy.
You may even consider the alternate option to be the main and only priority, so the player should clear all zerg before time runs out.

4th map:
Seem like no real changes.

5th map:
It looks okay, but it`s too easy.

6th map:
Altough at the Norad II side there was a few hot moments, the gameplay is almost too easy with siege tanks, siege being available, I think it should be removed.

7th map:
Pretty good stuff what you did here with the counters going on. ;) Altough the map itself is again, easy.

8th map:
Wow. Nice that you extracted this stuff. :o Good job, pretty good map, the best so far. I managed to kill all Zerg and win that way, but the zerg throw everything it could, so good job on this one.

9th map:
It really makes sense how you edited this one, as the storytelling implies that Duke has some military force behind him, namely the Alpha Squadron.
There was only one nuke, and the orange didn`t bought battlecruisers, this was easy too.

10th map:
The idea is all right, but I managed to fail both time I tried this (losing all ghosts, losing a hero).


11th map:
Not much changed, easy.

12th map:
Pretty easy, not much to say.


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Fey » Thu Jun 02, 2016 6:22 am

Thank you for playing through my campaign. :) I'll respond to what's under the spoiler:

Spoiler: show
TM01:
The idea of making those tougher zerglings simply have more movement and attack speed is great. I could do something with that, and it would make more sense than hero units.

TM02:
Infinite queen spawn? There's only one queen... isn't there? I don't remember putting in an infinite queen spawn. And, if there is one there, how come it's a bad idea? I mean, I can think of a few reasons, but I wanna hear it from you.

TM03:
My design changes were often about, uhh... linearity. I tried to make the maps less linear and all. So making that the only option isn't really something I would do, but I do agree that the defense strategy is disproportionately difficult to the offense strategy. Any suggestions about improving the latter option?

TM04:
Yep. I was thinking of putting in some aggressive attack triggers, or some more scripted events, though...

TM05:
The AI just doesn't work on this map. It looked great until the AI stopped working, but I haven't been able to get it to work, sadly. If you want to take a look, be my guest. I would love to know what the problem is!

TM06:
The idea behind the decision to put siege tanks into the map comes from the upping of the AI. P4 can be blown through with relative ease, and if you build up quick, you can fortify the position between P5 and Norad II, which would prevent those hot moments. Like, the changes were meant to encourage aggressive gameplay.

I assume you got TM07 and TM08 mixed up... TM08 is the one with the countdown timer and the king of the hill, TM07 is the one with, uhh... all that crazy stuff. I'm gonna respond to them in reverse:

TM07:
Thank you very much! Biting the Bullet is the map I worked the hardest on, and I was very happy with the result, myself. :) Any comments on the protoss' arrival?

TM08:
I figured it made sense to have Norad II being repaired at some point during these missions. The king of the hill part was a concept I was eager to implement on this map, since in the first, you could just, uhh... defensive matrix the SCV and send it to the beacon, and it's GG.

TM09:
Really? You found this map easy? You must be a pretty good player. Personally, I balanced these around my own difficulty level, which is rather average. The things that made this map tricky are their stationary defenses, their tendency to fortify around each-other's bases, and the general openness of your own base and the outpost in the upper left you can get. I would, however, love to know how to edit the AI to not be so... predictable, and so slow. I've looked into a few programs but it all looks too complex to really focus on learning right now. Any suggestions?

TM10:
Really? You failed this map? I find this one of the easiest maps of them all lol. Something ain't right here XD But, uhh, you can complete the map without nukes. Did it in testing.

TM11:
Some more resources were added, the AI was tweaked, and it was split into two factions. Unfortunately, the protoss AI doesn't seem very active, which is, again, something I'd love to fix if I can figure out how to edit Starcraft AI, lol.

TM12:
The AI tends to fortify around the Ion Cannon, but it's the same as any other AI. This is one of my least favorite maps in the whole campaign since, for some reason, it feels like more of a drag than any other mission. You know? Kinda feels like filler. I would love to make it into something special but to be honest, I'm not really sure where to start.


Thank you, again, for playing through my campaign! I would love to hear back from you!

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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby noname » Thu Jun 02, 2016 8:01 am

Answers
Spoiler: show
2 When I killed the queen a new one spawned on top of the queens nest, I killed it again, and again.

3 You got right the basic idea, I like it. You could do here some triggered attacks and more zerg buildings for unit production.

7 I forgot to mention I didn`t seen a single protoss unit / building on it.

9 More computer buildings maybe and more attack triggers.


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Fey » Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:04 am

Ah, thank you.
Spoiler: show
TM02:
Oh, gosh, that's odd. I should go and fix that.

TM03:
I think the zerg have enough buildings on the map, but a few more triggered attacks or better AI would be nice.

TM07:
What? That's not possible. The protoss come in after the massive zerg wave does; they're supposed to save your ass. What exactly did you do on this map?

TM09:
I could throw in some defensive response triggers for the battlecruisers in dock... but really I'd prefer to just design a better AI.


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby MattTygore » Thu Jun 23, 2016 9:49 am

" so the player should clear all zerg before time runs out."

Eh, we don't really need hard-timer SC2-esque missions in here, those aren't very fun.


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Revolta » Thu Jun 23, 2016 3:22 pm

Pretty much any time-based gimmick is ridiculous and probably shouldn't be in the game, barring a situation where the lore demands it.


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Fey » Thu Jun 30, 2016 2:43 am

Agreed, Matt.

Non-linear gameplay was one of my goals when re-designing some of these maps. Defense for 30 minutes is cool and should be viable, but offense should be an option too, shouldn't it?


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Fey » Fri Jul 01, 2016 9:54 am

Update going out. Check the OP for more information. Continue reading this post for information on what I could use help testing. If you just want to play, here's the update link:
Redacted. See OP for updated stuff!
Last edited by Fey on Sun Mar 04, 2018 4:26 am, edited 2 times in total.


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Fey » Fri Jul 08, 2016 7:21 pm

Apologies for the triple post. I figure that letting y'all in on an update warrants some more chatter. If I am mistaken, please let me know.

...I'm not talking about another update for the Terran campaign, I'd edit the previous post for that. I mean an update on what's happening with the Zerg campaign!

Skytech RTS, or MattTygore on CC, gave the Terran campaign a playthrough on his channel. Since witnessing another player's strategies and whatnot helped me make changes to the Terran campaign, I let him have early access to the zerg campaign. The first mission is already up here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcnKRwyWEU8

For the first time, I made a reply video. The purpose of the reply was to communicate the changes I made based on my observations of his own gameplay to Skytech. It's unlisted, but y'all may have a link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ7HP6SwLxk

Please note that due to recent YouTube trouble, I had to scrunch my own video into under 15 minutes. I cut certain parts out, such as menu time or periods of black screen, and I sped up the gameplay whenever my units weren't in combat. Please refer to the description for more information, though it's mostly just a verbal communication to Skytech and comments on the playthrough, occasionally pertaining to enemy AI changes or my own strategies.

Anyway, with that said, there are two things I wanted to get across. The first was that progress is currently being made on fine-tuning the Zerg campaign, and the second thing was that if anyone else wanted to test it out, I just need you to remember to send me details on every map - and I mean in detail - after you give 'em a try. You can post 'em on this thread, preferably under spoiler tags, if you'd like. It might also be prudent to take video since I can see exactly what you're doing and apply those observations to my map design, but if you cannot, specific and carefully considered suggestions posted here or in PM would be a-okay. If you would like to do this, just send me a PM and I'll reply with a link. :)

For reference, I need to know stuff like if there are any glitches in triggers that occur sometimes and not at other times, anything overtuned about the map, or undertuned, anything particularly out of place, such as units or upgrades available or triggers of some sort that cause something weird to happen, or if there are any parts of the map that move too quickly or too slowly.

Thank you! I hope to hear back from y'all.

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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Connor56203 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 1:32 am

sup everyone

cant wait too start playing this hopefully its really hard!! i need a good challenge to push my skills to the max (sorry if it sounds really cocky)
ive played that "INSANE" campaign but its complete BS some of the missions are complete able but some/most are really stupid

is terran the only campaign that you guys have completed? or need a beta tester please tell me i will not hold back on the feedback! -
to make it the absolute awesomeness/best it can be! :) (msg me on skype? connor7-11)
Thanks!
EDIT 1: [Link to my playlist > http://bit.ly/2abkUeo]
EDIT 2: mission 4 Jacobs installation what did you change in this mission or did i just suck during this mission?


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby MattTygore » Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:46 am

DELETED
Last edited by MattTygore on Wed Nov 30, 2016 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby MattTygore » Wed Nov 30, 2016 9:01 am

UPDATE.

Hey admins, Fey (the crreator of these maps) has informed me that he's still working on the campaign, he just can't log in to his account because he forgot his password.

Here's the conversation we had on youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wg_F9Q ... nhbnyctwv0


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Fey » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:32 pm

Hey guys, I actually got the password reset e-mail this time, so I'm back in my account! I haven't forgotten about this campaign! Has anyone else given it a try?

It's been over a year and I've been doing lots of other stuff, but I'd love to do some more work on this thing when I get the chance.I'm gonna have a look at these ol' maps and see about updating them here or there. It seems I haven't publicly released the Zerg campaign, so I guess I could do that.

I'm sorry I'm not coming back with any updates right now, but I just wanted to say hello again and let y'all know I'm still kickin'. I'll see about updating the OP soon with new information and maybe some new maps and stuff. ^^


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Re: Polishing up / redesigning the original Starcraft campaign

Postby Revolta » Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:39 pm

By 'updates to AI' did you actually edit the scripts? Seems cool if so, not too many people are working with custom AI these days.


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