[New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new name)

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Church » Tue Oct 26, 2010 8:49 am

Any updates? : D
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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby omega20 » Sun Oct 31, 2010 3:34 pm

Jim_Raynor wrote:Any updates? : D


Of course. I've already made the tests I needed and I expect to make a release of mission 10 alongside the fixed first 6 maps within the next few days. ;)

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Church » Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:20 am

Awesome :)

Also, I apologise for the lack of a finished review, I've been really busy the past few days. I'll get it to you as soon as possible.
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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby omega20 » Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:04 pm

Jim_Raynor wrote:Awesome :)

Also, I apologise for the lack of a finished review, I've been really busy the past few days. I'll get it to you as soon as possible.


Don't worry. I haven't had time to play your campaign either. :( Still, I'll try to find a proper moment to review it, since for now all my time with SC1 is just for testing, fixing and reviewing my own campaign.

Speaking of which, here you have the links for the new fixed version. I know it comes a bit late, but well, too much business in RL:

See links in first post

Enjoy! :D
Last edited by omega20 on Fri Nov 19, 2010 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Eredalis » Fri Nov 19, 2010 6:48 am

Sorry, I have deleted my first post accidentally.
Since I've played Dark Swarm SE from Legion the past days, I'd give your campaign a shot, too. But what on earth, yet in the first level is a bug...

After you've defended the infested CC successfully, happens nothing further. The problem is the condition in the victory trigger: *Current player commands at least 1 Infested CC*. This cannot work, because you did change the ownership of the infested CC to a neutral player in the trigger named 'Infest Command Center, begin third part'.

I have downloaded the campaign from the link of the first post. Don't know, if there is a fixed version already.

E/
Have downloaded now from the other link. Same game.
I guess, you didn't play that, did you? :sweat:
It is just a 64x64, play-testing should be no waste of time.

E 2/
Have now played mission 2. Very well done. The idea to reverse the original third mission of rebel yell is a nice touch. The protoss have killed me, I've realized now how difficult it was for the zerg player to harvest minerals from their mineral fields. (Because of unwieldy placement from Blizzard back in the day xD)

E 3/
Mission 3 is also very nice, but only the design of the terrain and the utilization of some abilities. I fight along with Lavarinth and use his valueable capabilities. To respawn the Hunter Killers was even necessary. What I don't like is the fact, that the Zerg interact verbally with the Protoss before the events of Char. This is... somehow unreally, it's too ficitional. The Overmind holds in the early events of StarCraft the Swarm at bay, only watching and testing out. The first verbal contact executes actually on Char between Zeratul and himself. But interact with the protoss verbally at this time, yet? Rather not. Precisely because EOTS implied a reverse version of Rebel yell in the first two levels, such heavy changes on the original plot lines is peculiar. And Zerg can operate a computer...? That's are things, which stabs the nice maps and gameplay in the back. :S

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby omega20 » Fri Nov 19, 2010 2:51 pm

Eredalis wrote:Sorry, I have deleted my first post accidentally.
Since I've played Dark Swarm SE from Legion the past days, I'd give your campaign a shot, too. But what on earth, yet in the first level is a bug...

After you've defended the infested CC successfully, happens nothing further. The problem is the condition in the victory trigger: *Current player commands at least 1 Infested CC*. This cannot work, because you did change the ownership of the infested CC to a neutral player in the trigger named 'Infest Command Center, begin third part'.

I have downloaded the campaign from the link of the first post. Don't know, if there is a fixed version already.

E/
Have downloaded now from the other link. Same game.
I guess, you didn't play that, did you? :sweat:
It is just a 64x64, play-testing should be no waste of time.


I played it quite a few times in order to test the difficulty of the mission. But that was just the first few times. Once I fixed it I just reviewed the triggers. Play-testing it is no waste of time indeed. But playing it again and again can become boring. While I try to be most careful at triggering, I think I just missed some bugs. My bad. :(

I've already fixed it. Try this one. It should work:

http://www.sendspace.com/file/aps4rn

Eredalis wrote:E 2/
Have now played mission 2. Very well done. The idea to reverse the original third mission of rebel yell is a nice touch. The protoss have killed me, I've realized now how difficult it was for the zerg player to harvest minerals from their mineral fields. (Because of unwieldy placement from Blizzard back in the day xD)


Glad you liked it. ;)

Eredalis wrote:E 3/
Mission 3 is also very nice, but only the design of the terrain and the utilization of some abilities. I fight along with Lavarinth and use his valueable capabilities. To respawn the Hunter Killers was even necessary. What I don't like is the fact, that the Zerg interact verbally with the Protoss before the events of Char. This is... somehow unreally, it's too ficitional. The Overmind holds in the early events of StarCraft the Swarm at bay, only watching and testing out. The first verbal contact executes actually on Char between Zeratul and himself. But interact with the protoss verbally at this time, yet? Rather not. Precisely because EOTS implied a reverse version of Rebel yell in the first two levels, such heavy changes on the original plot lines is peculiar. And Zerg can operate a computer...? That's are things, which stabs the nice maps and gameplay in the back. :S


Well, the 'Zerg' don't interact with the Protoss, in that sense of the word. In this mission, they just receive a warning message from the Protoss, but it's not supposed for the Protoss to know about the whole Zerg command chain yet. In fact, the only true interaction between the Zerg and Protoss happens in later missions, between Venezoth (the Protoss commander) and Grothesk, a lower strain who has been given the gift of sentience. The Overmind really stands to his role of watching and moving the strings of the Swarm from the shadows, but that doesn't means that lower 'commander' strains cannot interact with anyone. I don't see how can that be unreallistic.

Thanks for your review!

~omega20

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Eredalis » Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:06 am

Thin ice, but ok. :)
More feedback will come...

/E

Mission 4:
Aaargh. This music is annoying. "(I am a?) heeeeerrooo..." Hear this twenty-five minutes gets quite a fright. The start of the level is confusing: Joking Zerg? Wtf?? That is without a doubt very strange. The heart of the level is excellent. Killing Duke, or better bring the Norad II down, fills up a good portion of atmosphere. I've morphed over thirty Scourges and attack Duke's Battlecruiser frontally. The direct way is the easiest.

Mission 5:
The best mission, so far. The spawing pool stands a little bit in the way of the drones, if these try to harvest from the extractor. Number of Minerals reaches only just... (Maybe you should set a few more.) Only the last dialogue between the Terran commander and Lavarinth is... :) strange! You know, this is exactly the problem I've mentioned above. Although you've decided to put this in your campaign, it doesn't figure somehow in the original storyline. But ok, it's your campaign, it's your decision...

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby omega20 » Fri Nov 26, 2010 12:06 pm

My apologies. I didn't notice you had actually edited your post! I'm sorry for the delay.

Eredalis wrote:Mission 4:
Aaargh. This music is annoying. "(I am a?) heeeeerrooo..." Hear this twenty-five minutes gets quite a fright. The start of the level is confusing: Joking Zerg? Wtf?? That is without a doubt very strange. The heart of the level is excellent. Killing Duke, or better bring the Norad II down, fills up a good portion of atmosphere. I've morphed over thirty Scourges and attack Duke's Battlecruiser frontally. The direct way is the easiest.


I hadn't thought about the music. It was just my first try in implementing vocal music tracks in maps, and it seems it didn't work. I will look for some other track that fits better. About the start of the level... well it was supposed to be as a kind of "warm up" for the player. I though a joke here and there couldn't be bad. Grothesk is... special. He has a curious "sense of humor", given to him in order to give him a personality, instead having him as your average mindless Zerg.

Glad you liked the level so far. ;)

Eredalis wrote:Mission 5:
The best mission, so far. The spawing pool stands a little bit in the way of the drones, if these try to harvest from the extractor. Number of Minerals reaches only just... (Maybe you should set a few more.) Only the last dialogue between the Terran commander and Lavarinth is... :) strange! You know, this is exactly the problem I've mentioned above. Although you've decided to put this in your campaign, it doesn't figure somehow in the original storyline. But ok, it's your campaign, it's your decision...


Well, I've already explained it. I also sensed that it would be strange to have the Zerg communicating with Protoss and Terrans this early in the storyline. Because of that I (spoilers start here; it is adviseable to have completed missions 9 and 10 before reading any further. Read at your own risk)
decided to having those who have made any verbal contact with any Zerg killed for the greater good. If there's no survivor who can tell about these "talking" Zerg, anyone would know about them and, in the overall storyline, it'll be just like if nothing had happened.
(spoilers end here) I know this may sound a bit of a rush, but having a so long campaign without any dialogue with the enemy would be rather... repetitive.

Glad you liked this mission. I will try to have a solution for your suggestions in order to improve the gameplay.

Thank you so much for your valuable feedback.

Cheers!

~omega20

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Lavarinth » Sat Nov 27, 2010 2:36 pm

Clever use of blue text.
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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Eredalis » Sat Dec 04, 2010 1:29 pm

+ Mission 6 +

There are a few bugs:

-- First transmission of Araq in the briefing room is the speech time of the portrait too short.
-- Misspelling: painfull => painful
-- The music of the boss fight overlap with the level music, what is very annoying, because this fight is hard enough.

This mission sucks. Seriously! Not only, that the difficult level is very high, the terrain design doesn't fits to the difficulty. The complete placement of the space platforms are way too tight. And there are dead ends, on which own units get stuck. (Especially the south-west entrance of the base in direction of the teal protoss base, because of doodads.) But the problem with the density is the greatest bugbear: You see, to command your units through these rabbit holes isn't adviceable for such a classical B&D mission, where you need space to fight. Else I've seen your explanation with the dialogue just between the Templar and Lavarinth.

The boss fight is a surprising element after the supposed end. What I don't like is, that this fight is hard. Too hard for me. Don't know, how to get this...

+ Mission 7 +

Hmm... somehow nothing special, at all. Just another (very) long-breathed 'Build and Destroy' mission. There is nothing else to do except to breed enough units and fight, fight, fight, fight, fight, fight on this huge map... That's boring. You've shown in other levels much more ingenuity. Only the dialogue between Duke and Reikson is cool, like all these other moments, which referenced to the original storyline. The resources are not enough. The few expansion points contain insufficient minerals. Maybe you should advance these a little bit.

+ Mission 8 +

Oh great. Another slugfest on a big map with virtually no expansions for the player itself. You have to place inmediately more minerals and gas geysers. Otherwise you will have no chance to achieve your objectives. I wonder, if the Cerberus Unit really would participate on a battle like this. I don't think so. And the greatest bug is the end of the level: It ends with a defeat trigger instead of a victory trigger. D:

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby noname » Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:12 am

I can`t replay this campaign, cause after download the zipped file gives error..
Can someone reupload this please?

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Church » Wed Feb 02, 2011 8:01 am

@noname: Here's a temporary upload I made, you can use it untill Omega gets a beter one: http://www.filefront.com/17883244/EOTS-TEMP.rar/
Just a note, it's for version 1.3.

@Omega: I've finally had time to get back to work on the review, expect it soon!
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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby noname » Thu Feb 03, 2011 10:03 am

Thanks a lot! :)

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Legion » Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:23 pm

I'm just going to put this out there.

Most of your briefing text from your first mission was completely ripped from my Dark Swarm briefing.

Asshole.

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Re: [New Campaign] StarCraft I: Echoes of the Swarm (new nam

Postby Lavarinth » Wed Mar 23, 2011 2:00 pm

omega20 appears to have vanished, there's more "trigger copying" than just your campaign, Legion, as has recently been informed to me.
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